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Speeding from the outset.

An unofficial portal to direct your questions to the Broads Authority about the management of the Norfolk Broads.
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Miles
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Re: Speeding from the outset.

Post by Miles » April 8th, 2019, 1:19 pm

With all due respect Hylander and I mean that most sincerely, it is a classic case of if a tree falls in the forest when nobody is there, does that falling tree make a noise?
100% of hire boat collisions that I have personally experienced or witnessed have never stopped. Not in one single incident. Why is that? No two people are the same but the same reaction happens every single time. This indicates to me that the problem stems from the administration, namely the boat yard.
You could moor there for thirty years and be totally oblivious to what goes on. I know this as I have met people who say they have been coming here for 20 years and only had a couple of scrapes. The truth of the matter is they are actually here for a couple of weeks a year and get through that time fairly unscathed.
For someone who has been here 24/7 365 days a year for the past five years, I can conclude that if most folks knew what really went on with these hire boats a lot of the time, they would sell their boat and buy a caravan.
There are many who disagree with my statements but they are not here, they are busy copying and pasting, counting Facebook likes and in apathy mostly.
I would urge anyone to go and spend just a day or two in the area the other member has described and come away wondering how anyone can sleep at night knowing their boat is left moored there.
⛵ Life is short, even on its longest day ⛵

lgwarren
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Re: Speeding from the outset.

Post by lgwarren » April 8th, 2019, 4:45 pm

Spot on Miles. Being on the front line is an eye opener. My experiences mirror your own and as you, I have never seen anyone stop after a collision. Most are unaware that boats have "rear wheel steering".
To comment on the BA Chief Executive’s Report that I received, I quote from it below.....
"During the 2018/19 year the rangers undertook 6,147 verbal warnings, which is in line with 6,278 the previous year. A total of 257 written warnings were issued, again comparable with 260 last year."
The use of the terms "in line with the previous year" and "comparable with last year" show that these figures seem to be acceptable to the BA and an acceptance by them that no improvement is an achievement. Well I disagree, to me it is a deterioration and an admission that the BA have not improved the safety of the waterway.

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Miles
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Re: Speeding from the outset.

Post by Miles » April 8th, 2019, 5:20 pm

6147 verbal warnings? :roll:
If that had been 6147 byelaw enforcements then none of this nonsense and I reiterate that....zero of this nonsense would be going on.
The sheer fact that 6147 incidents require intervention indicates the scale of the issue.
What is really disconcerting is those are incidents perceived by the Broads Authority no doubt, what about the ones they are not there to see?
Trust me please when I write this.........there are a lot of trees falling down and if you are not there, then you won't hear it lol. :roll:
Two or three hundred written warnings? For goodness sake, what is that going to achieve?
Might as well give them a hundred lines and say, you very, very naughty boys.
I have spent the day at Sutton Staithe. A full length hire boat came in towing a dinghy and smacked two bails of **** out of two private boats on the boat yard. Myself and others then helped the hire boat to safely moor as otherwise he was going to whack me again
That ain't happening anymore. I am done with hire boat damage and getting stitched up.
The people on the boat had had it for four days and still were unable to perform the simplest of manoeuvres, in this case a three point turn if you like.
Later on a ranger came down in the boat, turned around and stopped to tell a private boat it's registration was not in the right place. I would imagine that counts as verbal warning.
Why doesn't the Broads Authority come and sit down on the grass one sunny day for a whole day and just watch in amazement as to what unfolds before their very eyes?
All I can say to the powers that be is if you don't believe me, don't take my word for it come and see for yourself. I would recommend casual clothes rather than uniforms and no blue lights on top of boats as that has the immediate effect of getting people to give a toss about what they are doing behind a 10 tonne boat.
Come see for yourselves.
⛵ Life is short, even on its longest day ⛵

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David
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Re: Speeding from the outset.

Post by David » April 8th, 2019, 6:14 pm

No disrespect but being on the golf moorings for 4 years we had our fair share of incidents on numerous occasions the hire boats came past that fast we were thrown all over the place and being the 4th morning from the end as the boats turned out of Swan quay they used to over correct and there path normally was heading in our direction and at that time we only had a 27ft boat that got hit a few times and on one occasion tore our davits off the back of the boat along with our dingy, the last straw was when we changed the boat last summer for a 35ft Bourne only to get it hit yet again and on the last bashing having our bathing ladder badly bent, Richardsons did repair it but was told if we got hit again they probably would not fix it because of the length of our boat on that morning even though the max length allowed was 35ft so with that attitude we left and when across the river
A boat makes a big hole in the water in to which you throw money

lgwarren
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Re: Speeding from the outset.

Post by lgwarren » April 9th, 2019, 10:57 am

Hi David, you seem to have had a different experience than Hylander on the same moorings. You would not get me on there for love nor money. I would probably buy a caravan :lol:
The figures I quoted in my previous post should have included the fact that there were only 2 prosecutions for speeding from the 6 and a half thousand known transgressions. Maybe the Rangers should get commission on results !!

lgwarren
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Re: Speeding from the outset.

Post by lgwarren » April 9th, 2019, 2:42 pm

Letter winging it's way to the BA. Lets hope I get a response.

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Miles
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Re: Speeding from the outset.

Post by Miles » April 9th, 2019, 4:31 pm

I am sure you will get a delayed yet well thought out and written response with the intention of filling a space as if it was an administrative void that needs to be softly massaged out of public attention.
Stand your ground, film it, I will gladly post it on my channel if you prefer?
I have a platform, it is there to be used.
You are not trying to punish anyone or anything, you just want to make the Norfolk Broads a waterways and not a dodgem park.
Personally, I have total respect for your intentions.
Support is there and available
Solutions are easy.
It's getting folks to realise there is a problem in the first place.
I don't need convincing. :roll:
Please do keep us updated, there ARE people who give a monkeys. :D
⛵ Life is short, even on its longest day ⛵

lgwarren
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Re: Speeding from the outset.

Post by lgwarren » April 10th, 2019, 8:41 am

Thank you Miles, I appreciate your support. I will keep you updated.

lgwarren
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Re: Speeding from the outset.

Post by lgwarren » April 22nd, 2019, 8:59 am

I have had my response from the BA, and I paraphrase it's contents below.

Verbal warnings
are given when the observed speed is only slightly above the limit.
"For more serious offences (depending on the situation, but around 1mph above the limit) a written warning will be given."
These are held on file to use as evidence against repeat offenders.
"The more serious offences are always investigated and reviewed for prosecution."
This I assume means somewhere over 5mph.
They state that
......we rely on the public to report any instances of speeding via our control office (01603 756056). We will always follow up on reports we receive this way. Photos or video are particularly helpful although we know this is not always possible.


Last year they trialled a light up speed sign at Wroxham, which was apparently successful enough for them to be deploying four more. One at Stalham I hope. They also accepted my request to have an officer visit my mooring on changeover day so that I can explain my concerns.
Reading some of your latest posts Miles, I would assume that reporting collisions on the above number would also expect a response.

Well the situation is now back in my hands to start to document the problems I have. Below is a small table showing a)feet per second, b) how long certain boats take to pass a fixed point.

mph …....... fps …......... 25 …....... 30 ….......... 37 ….......... 40 ….......... 44
4 …....... 5.87 …....... 4.26 …....... 5.11 …....... 6.31 …....... 6.82 …....... 7.50
5 …....... 7.33 …....... 3.41 …....... 4.09 …....... 5.05 …....... 5.45 …....... 6.00
6 …....... 8.80 …....... 2.84 …....... 3.41 …....... 4.20 …....... 4.55 …....... 5.00

Therefore a 44ft boat at 4mph should take no less than 7.50 seconds to pass, otherwise it is speeding.
Last edited by lgwarren on April 22nd, 2019, 10:00 am, edited 2 times in total.

lgwarren
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Re: Speeding from the outset.

Post by lgwarren » April 22nd, 2019, 9:02 am

Sorry will post speed table as soon as i can format it properly. :?: :?: :lol:
Sorted above.
Last edited by lgwarren on April 22nd, 2019, 10:12 am, edited 2 times in total.

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